They should remember when they are pointing fingers, there are three pointing at them for every one that they point!   "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone."

What bothers me about the Tebow nonsense is when people say that his teams (or he) wins BECAUSE of his faith. Utter nonsense. He is one of the worst quarterbacks in the NFL statistics-wise. He win by dumb luck.

 

Besides - if he did win because of his faith, what does that say about the other teams? And does god really care who wins a football game? Seriously.....

wins BECAUSE of his faith...................................I agree and I don't think Tim thinks he wins because of his faith either.  I applaud the fact that he is willing to acknowledge and be thankful that God gave him certain abilities.  I can already hear the critics who are waiting for the Broncos to lose so they can say "where's God now" !!!   I doubt that God concerns himself with who wins, either, but I think He is concerned about how Christians conduct themselves.

And does god really care who wins a football game? Seriously.....

 

Nope --- and Tebow himself stated that (almost verbatem) in an interview that I saw on NFL network.       Bakerman's observation is quite accurate ... he gives thanks/praise/recognition to God at the beginning of each interview ---- but not for winning or losing a football game.

phil, do you have mine? If so, you could send your address to me

 

nope ... I don't have yours ...

Of course, our ethnocentric perspective would paint one "good" and the other "evil".
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and that is why those twp words on their own are very dangerous.

I thought there was a science to sports...you know the idea that spiraling football goes farther? Physics whilst thanking  the Lord for  creating the ability to spiral a football?

It is offensive to many to try to see the perspective of those we see as evil. Understanding never has been the same as condoning.

And does god really care who wins a football game? Seriously.....

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No, but I bet he enjoys a good game despite the outcome. Gotta do something to recuperate from all those boring sermons He/She is forced to listen to. Worse than grading bad essays.

Gotta do something to recuperate from all those boring sermons He/She is forced to listen to.

 

:-)

 

Has to be some compensation for taking 6 or 7 days out His/Her busy schedule to create the universe .... Although I would think that some trivial football games would hardly compare with colliding galaxies ...

 

 

In any case, you could probably start with The God Delusion


If you want to do atheism a favor, you really shouldn't be promoting that book.  Dawkins' wit and charm cover his arguments on the surface, but you dig just a little deeper and it unravels.  Not atheism's best work. 

If you want to do atheism a favor, you really shouldn't be promoting that book.  Dawkins' wit and charm cover his arguments on the surface, but you dig just a little deeper and it unravels.  Not atheism's best work.  [Post #51]

 

I take it then that you’ve read it from cover to cover?

 

It is certainly not perfect and I’ve leveled my own criticisms at it and have suggested, I think, taking it with a grain or two of salt. For instance his criticisms of Aquinas’ proofs for the existence of God are a little wide of the mark or start off on the wrong foot, but when you take a look at them closely the differences between what Aquinas presented and what Dawkins attacked are largely cosmetic and the arguments have just as much force and validity. And I think that he doesn’t give as much credit to the “metaphorical and pantheistic God of the physicists” as I think it deserves.

 

But it also covers a lot of ground and hits a great many of the major flaws of religion. If more in the religious community read it – from cover to cover – with an open mind instead of chucking it in the landfill at the first sign of a challenge to their vaunted and unsupportable dogma, then there might be the possibility of some salutary and useful and necessary dialog.

I take it then that you’ve read it from cover to cover?

It is certainly not perfect and I’ve leveled my own criticisms at it and have suggested, I think, taking it with a grain or two of salt. For instance his criticisms of Aquinas’ proofs for the existence of God are a little wide of the mark or start off on the wrong foot, but when you take a look at them closely the differences between what Aquinas presented and what Dawkins attacked are largely cosmetic and the arguments have just as much force and validity. And I think that he doesn’t give as much credit to the “metaphorical and pantheistic God of the physicists” as I think it deserves.

But it also covers a lot of ground and hits a great many of the major flaws of religion. If more in the religious community read it – from cover to cover – with an open mind instead of chucking it in the landfill at the first sign of a challenge to their vaunted and unsupportable dogma, then there might be the possibility of some salutary and useful and necessary dialog.

I did read the entire book about 3 years or so ago.  He likes to deal with the weakest arguments for God/Christianity and goes for the sensational.  I started reading Sam Harris and Christopher Hitchens not too long after, but baby came along and for some reason haven't gotten back to reading like I used to.  :-) 


As for reading works by "the other side" so-to-speak, it goes both ways.  I find atheists that really don't understand arguments for theism because they assume they know them because they heard something from so and so.  Unfortunately, there are Christians who don't understand arguments for theism either!  :-)  I'm not saying everyone has to be a scholar, apologist, whatever, but it seems like thinking deeply and critically about things is something of the past now.  Guess no one has time for it anymore.

I started reading Sam Harris and Christopher Hitchens not too long after ... [Post #53]

 

Good for you; I’ve only read reviews of both – critical and otherwise, and I can see where the criticisms have some justification.  

 

but baby came along and for some reason haven't gotten back to reading like I used to.  :-) 

 

Understandable. :-)

 

As for reading works by "the other side" so-to-speak, it goes both ways. I find atheists that really don't understand arguments for theism because they assume they know them because they heard something from so and so. 

 

Yes, I quite agree, although I think there are far more in the science field willing to give religion a fair shake by trying to understand and to discuss theology. For example you might want to take a look at this post by the biologist Jerry Coyne – author of the book Why Evolution is True – titled Why am I reading theology? He has a whole bunch of other posts along the same lines including on a discussion with the Catholic theologian John Haught – who really didn’t come across all that well as, for one thing, he attempted to suppress a video that was made of their discussion.

 

Unfortunately, there are Christians who don't understand arguments for theism either!  :-) 

 

Not sure that anyone does – even those who wrote them. :-)

 

 I'm not saying everyone has to be a scholar, apologist, whatever, but it seems like thinking deeply and critically about things is something of the past now.  Guess no one has time for it anymore.

 

Availability of time is probably a big part of it. But the accessibility of the information and the ready availability of a community of people to discuss the topics are also important issues – problems which the Internet seems to solve rather well.  

Has to be some compensation for taking 6 or 7 days out His/Her busy schedule to create the universe .... Although I would think that some trivial football games would hardly compare with colliding galaxies ...

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Everyone needs some down time. My communications professor used to say, we all need to stare into the fire now and then and that that was what watching some mindless TV shows substituted for. Football is trivial in the gran scheme of things but i find it entertaining. Now if God already knows the outcome, that would be less so.  I thought my son was very smart because he always got the Wheel of Fortune phrases right but then I realized he had watched it on another channel before. But I digress.

I did read the entire book about 3 years or so ago.  He likes to deal with the weakest arguments for God/Christianity and goes for the sensational.
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That tends to be the way of many of the posts here.