U.S.
    • Topic: 
    • Don't Abolish Guns, But Examine European Systems & Make Ownership Stringent
  • From: MWP2108
  •   To: All
  • 1 of 100
  • 4/20/07
I am an U.S. military member who served a total of seven years in Europe. My first tour was in Italy and I am currently on my second tour in Germany. I have visited several major cities here including Berlin, Frankfurt, Milan, Rome, Paris, Amsterdam, and others. During my seven years here, I can honestly say that there is not one street in any Western European city that I've been to where I felt threatened by the possibility of becoming the target of a firearm, day or night. On the other hand, as the VT incident proves "AGAIN", as well as the NASA Hostage Shooting in Houston today, one is not safe from gun violence anywhere in the United States because of our lackadaisical gun-ownership controls. How many times have you picked up a newspaper in the USA and read, not only about school massacres, but, about a drive by shooting at a mall or other violence involving a gun? Answer: Too often. Why do I feel much safer in Europe? Because although most European countries agree that an individual can own a firearm, just as we do in the U.S., they make the requirements to own one so stringent, time consuming, and expensive, that the ultimate effect of the European systems is that it weeds out the possibility of a firearm getting into the hands of undesirables. The benefit of such a stringent system is that it weeds out the possibility of firearms getting into the hands of idiots such as Erich Harris and Dylan Klebold (Columbine High Shootings), Seung-Hui Cho (Virginia Tech Shootings), John Allen Muhammad and Lee Boyd Malvo (DC Beltway Snipers), and most recently (today), William Phillips Jr. (NASA Hostage Shooting, Houston, Texas). I am not for removing gun-ownership from American society. However, I do believe that ONLY those adequately screened, and that can pass strenuous qualification requirements, should be entitled to own a gun. We, Americans, should examine the European systems and adapt similar gun-ownership qualifications that keep guns in the hands of good, qualified people, and take guns away from those that do not qualify or are not willing to endure the stringent background checks and licensing requirements for ownership. If current gun owners can meet such requirements, then they should have nothing to worry about. If gun-ownership is not made more stringent, then we should stop making such a big deal from these murders and start accepting such massacres as ?just part of the American way of life", then wait for the next massacre.
  • From: 2ndsupporter
  •   To: All
  • 2 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Why do I feel much safer in Europe? Because although most European countries agree that an individual can own a firearm, just as we do in the U.S., they make the requirements to own one so stringent, time consuming, and expensive, that the ultimate effect of the European systems is that it weeds out the possibility of a firearm getting into the hands of undesirables. -------- So only if you have a lot free time and money can one buy a gun? Everyone else is an undesireable? Sounds pretty elitist to me. Besides the right of the ppl to keep and bear arms shall not be INFRINGED.
  • From: MWP2108
  •   To: All
  • 3 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Yeah... everyone else like all the psychotics I mentioned earlier. Hey, if you think you would qualify, then you have nothing to worry about? This is not a matter of elitist vs. others... this is a matter of weeding out the psychos. My next door neighbor here in Germany owns a hunting rifle, but he went through two months of training and paid the 1,000 Euro for the training. He's an average, middle class, individual. So, in the USA, if you can't afford it, then OK, you don't get to own one. Tough luck... get a better job or stop living on credit. Regarding the 2nd amendment... out, no longer relevant with an active Army that consumes most of the federal budget.
  • From: 2ndsupporter
  •   To: All
  • 4 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Yeah... everyone else like all the psychotics I mentioned earlier. Hey, if you think you would qualify, then you have nothing to worry about? ====================================== When you fill out your 4473, there is a section that questions you about your mental condition. Then that info is verified thru NICS. CHO slipped thru due to State of VA regulations. All that needs to be done is to fine tune the system. And yes its elitist. Are you tellimg me that the poor are to have no means of defense? Poor does not equal psycho. Title 10 sec 311 US code tells us who and what the milita are and its just about everybody.
  • From: MWP2108
  •   To: All
  • 5 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Thanks... you just proved my point... "Cho slipped thru due to State of VA regulations (laws)." Proves very clearly that the CURRENT system does not need "fine tuning"... IT'S BROKE! What about the incident at NASA today??? Was that because the Texas system also needs "fine tuning"? Regarding Title 10... the true militia today is the National Guard. We have not called on our "unofficial" militia since the revolutionary war. Title 10 is a law, and laws, just as the 2nd "amendment" can change.
  • From: 2ndsupporter
  •   To: All
  • 6 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Regarding Title 10... the true militia today is the National Guard. We have not called on our "unofficial" militia since the revolutionary war. Title 10 is a law, and laws, just as the 2nd "amendment" can change. -------------------------------- The National Guard is a relatively new creation, it is not the original militia that was envisioned by the FF. The unorganized militia has not been called since the revolutionary war but its not been disbanded.
  • From: MWP2108
  •   To: All
  • 7 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Oh... really... wow, it would be nice if that "unorganized" militia could contribute about 30,000 members to the country's efforts in Iraq and Afghanistan, so that those great Americans serving over there wouldn't have to now be spending 15 months over there instead of 12 months. Where is that "unorganized" militia in the current effort to defend our country? Cleaning their weapons and watching "American Idol"???
  • From: 2ndsupporter
  •   To: All
  • 8 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Oh... really... wow, it would be nice if that "unorganized" militia could contribute about 30,000 members to the country's efforts in Iraq and Afghanistan, so that those great Americans serving over there wouldn't have to now be spending 15 months over there instead of 12 months. Where is that "unorganized" militia in the current effort to defend our country? Cleaning their weapons and watching "American Idol"??? ---------------- Thats not a call you or I can make....The Commander in Chief is the one to make that call.
  • From: A_T_R
  •   To: All
  • 9 of 100
  • 4/22/07
Right on. Where are all these SuperPatriots in the War on Terror? Just as you note, they are sitting at home, waiting for the black rapist of their paranoid imagination to come through the door so they can shoot him. And maybe later threatening the wife with the gun if she gets too uppitty. I would HAPPILY see all those great defenders of the Constitution shipped off to Afghanistan and Iraq to fight the terrorists. But of course they will not go.
  • From: 2ndsupporter
  •   To: All
  • 10 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Thanks... you just proved my point... "Cho slipped thru due to State of VA regulations (laws)." Proves very clearly that the CURRENT system does not need "fine tuning"... IT'S BROKE! What about the incident at NASA today??? Was that because the Texas system also needs "fine tuning"? ----------------- No news on texas that I could find other than homicide detectives found no evidence of a gun at his house. You can only speculate if the gun was bought legally or illegally.
  • From: spselby
  •   To: All
  • 11 of 100
  • 4/22/07
Regarding Title 10... the true militia today is the National Guard. Too new and by the courts, the militia is the general populace, not the guard.
  • From: spselby
  •   To: All
  • 12 of 100
  • 4/22/07
Regarding the 2nd amendment... out, no longer relevant with an active Army that consumes most of the federal budget. The amendment was written, not to be the military, but to protect us from the government. A government that doesn't have any fear of reprisal from the people is one that can do what ever they want. See also, dictatorships of the world.
  • From: bigdee40
  •   To: All
  • 13 of 100
  • 4/20/07
and we could use their system of land ownership as well. where only 10% of the people own 99% of the land. just part of the american way of life ????????????? correct me if i'm wrong , and i'm not, but isn't russia in eurape???????? and wasn't there a school shooting in russia and what about the theat;;;;well we see the picture all you want to do is make ever where unsafe, not just schools, BRILLIANT!!!!!
  • From: MWP2108
  •   To: All
  • 14 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Apparently, you've never lived in Europe. Land ownership is not "10% of the people"... most people own their own homes, as in the USA. No... Russia is not considered a part of Europe. Seems like, from your lack of knowledge of geography... you are "reeeallly" brilliant. Hope you don't own a gun. By the way, Europe is spelled with an "o", not an "a". I spelled it for you several times in my letter above.
  • From: MWP2108
  •   To: All
  • 15 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Let me correct myself, Russia is part of the European continent, but when I say "Europe", I mean the European Union. Russia is not part of the European Union.
  • From: spselby
  •   To: All
  • 16 of 100
  • 4/22/07
wasn't there a school shooting in russia No, it was near Frankfurt Germany.
  • From: spselby
  •   To: All
  • 17 of 100
  • 4/22/07
wasn't there a school shooting in russia Oops, actually, I forgot about the slaughter at the Russian school. Sorry.
  • From: cpudoc_the_first
  •   To: All
  • 18 of 100
  • 4/20/07
I really think you have your priorities confused. Have you ever been to a Doctor? Harvard did a study a couple of years ago and found that over 93,000 people per year were killed by Doctors either mistreating or misdiagnosing patients. That is over twice and many people killed by doctors than guns, even including suicide in the gun deaths. It is obvious that you dislike guns and are trying to find a reason to outlaw guns, even if you say you just want to make them dificult to own. We also have a constitutional amendment that guarantees us the uninfringed right to own guns. If you feel safer in Europe, I would consider moving there.
  • From: MWP2108
  •   To: All
  • 19 of 100
  • 4/20/07
Really surprised at where you came up with that figure... but, unrelated to this issue. I really don't care what doctor's do to their patients... suggest you select a different doctor. I do care that within a week, we had two gun violence incidents, one right after the other (VT and NASA). Do you understand the term "Amendment"? It means a change/addition to an original document. We can always amend the amendment, we're not talking about the bible, we're talking about law.
  • From: kindrox
  •   To: All
  • 20 of 100
  • 4/20/07
We also had a lot of people defend themselves with guns but its not sensational enough to make the network news. So the nitwits and ninnies the just watch the network news don't have a clue about what most of what happens in this country every day. A woman uses her pistol to shoot a would-be car jacker who already has a gun pointed at her husband http://www.wistv.com/Global/story.asp?S=5942137 A man is stabbed several times, retrieves gun, shoots attacker http://www.ukiahdailyjournal.com/ci_5686485?source=rss Man shoots home invader http://www.wreg.com/global/story.asp?s=6379453 Armed robber shot by store clerk http://www.katv.com/news/stories/0407/414869.html Two home invaders shot by homeowner http://www.news-press.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070416/NEWS0110/70416019 Woman shoots home invader http://www.wtoc.com/global/story.asp?s=6372628 Man uses gun to defend family against dogs http://www.kxly.com/index.php?story_id=10024 Two different homeowners defend against home invaders http://www.heraldcitizen.com/NF/omf.wnm/herald/news_story.html?rkey=0044201+cr=gdn Residents fight off two armed home invaders http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/news/12615615/detail.html?rss=pit&psp=news Man uses gun to defend against baseball bat http://www.eagletribune.com/punewsnh/local_story_104093830?keyword=secondarystory Home owners defend against attempted break in http://content.hamptonroads.com/story.cfm?story=123226&ran=60183
 
 
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